What do you get when you put two criminal masterminds together? David Whish-Wilson and Pol Koutsakis talking books! In this fascinating episode, the pair discuss the hero – or antihero – in Pol’s two books, Athenian Blues and Baby Blue. Stratos Gazis, an ‘ethical hitman’, has a moral code that controls his choices and leads to intrigue. David’s PI Frank Swann is in a similar boat, falling into the thick of criminal dealings when all he wants is a simple, happy life as a family man.